Miracles and Ideal Realism

Shridhar Maharaja often spoke of "Ideal Realism." Here is an excerpt of one such talk. I found this on the facebook page of Julie Cluer.

Miracles and Consciousness:

Ideal Realism

Devotee: We find occasionally that someone will read Krsna Book, tenth canto of Srimad-Bhagavatam, and they will have a hard time accepting these fantastic demons that appear in Vrndavana as more than stories. They'll have some difficulty because there's no trace of this kind of mysticism in the present modern age. These are fantastic descriptions, as Putana became twelve miles long when she fell to the ground. These are fantastic descriptions of events.

Srila Sridhar Maharaj: Can you conceive that the boy Krsna lifted Govardhana and put it on His finger? Can you conceive? That can be swallowed by those persons? If that can be adjusted then all these, everything can be adjusted. You see?

Devotee: Yes.

Srila Sridhar Maharaj: And the question you say that all comes from fossilism, fossil. Fossil is given, matter is given more importance over consciousness, but consciousness can create anything. That is the process we are to understand and digest that not from fossil everything is coming but from consciousness everything is coming, from spirit everything is coming. 

Then it will be clear to explain all these miracles. In the system of hypnotism can they be convinced about the divya-darsana, what is Krsna. Krsna showed He's such and such, can they digest this visva-rupa ? The universal form as Krsna He showed to Arjuna, can they digest that? You? Then that is all false?

Devotee: No.

Srila Sridhar Maharaj: So many things, how to explain that from the materialistic or scientific standpoint?

Devotee: They'll say it is all poetry.

Srila Sridhar Maharaj: From the same basis we are to view everything and all the conceptions of the present scholars based on this fossilism must be demolished wholesale. This is not the way of thinking for a man of devotion, they consider the spiritual substance is the cause and that can create every kind of fossil or any type every time. It is like a play doll, to create this matter, material form is a play doll in the hand of the spiritual autocrat. Everything is shown according to his own sweet will, no equal position of the material world. It is all floating on consciousness.

And the magical wand is His sweet will. Whatever He will like to show you are forced to see that. It is coming from up to down. So no material stability of the material characteristic of anything whatever, we say it is all false, all maya, concoction. It is seen from the plane of our very meagre local interest, all false. The wholesale false, all misconception. We're accustomed to think that a brick or a piece of stone is invulnerable but it is nothing, only a conception, idea, that may be.

Just as in dream we can have experience of many things very astonishing in dream, is it not? What is not possible to experience when we are awake, we are to offer it to our material senses what is not possible that is possible in dream. We can see a big mountain is being transformed into sea, an ocean may be transformed into moon, in dream many things.

So in the soul it is more independent in view is possible, it is such. We are to give up this narrow idea drawn from the material local conception from our brain, to brush it out. His sweet will is the cause of everything. Like a magician, like a hypnotising man, the basis must be accepted like that then we can explain everything here. How there are so many small and big incidents? 

How it was possible for Christ when He was crucified to come again? Some say that He was not dead. His dead body was taken to some mountain cave and after three days when people went to see Him nothing but some remnant of His dress was there and He is not there, the body could not be traced, gone away. How it is that when Peter he was in Italy, he ordered that He will be crucified he was flying away from Rome for fear of death. Then he met Christ is coming then he fell on the feet of Christ: "You Master You have come." "I'm going to be crucified a second time because My follower Peter he has betrayed Me and for fear of crucifiction he's flying away. So I'm going to be crucified for a second time." "No, no, my Master, You won't have to take the trouble of going to be crucified, I am going to be crucified." Then Peter: "What is this?" He saw Christ, and so many times they say Christ coming and going. Is it material science sanction?

All religious conception on their background must have some sort of immaterial over material supernatural experience on its back. Every religious class has some sort of miraculous conception on the back, everyone, because it is true, And what you conceive this is all false. What we experience through our senses that is false. How far can we rely on our senses? … The very root and nature of our existence that has been cancelled by the spiritual persons of every school. The Christian, Mohammedan, or Buddhist. Religion means depending on some super knowledge and the experience of super knowledge, religion means that. And those that depend on the sense experience they're almost all atheist. Everything coming from reading, reading eye experience, or ear experience. 

I am running in phantasmagoria. This body is the effect of a dream, something like dream, the mind. Mind is more independent than this body, so bodily experiences are more rigid and narrow than the mental experiences. The experience of the intelligence that is higher and more spacious. In this way experience of atma (soul), atma can do anything, independence of the soul in all respects is extremely greater than that of this body. Just as mind's scope is greater than this body experience, so the scope of the knowledge of atma, that is infinitely more spacious than that of the body experience. In this way. And in Paramatma conception more wide things are possible. In this way the progressive to Krsna is possible, no restriction over Him. 

His sweet will can never be opposed by any potency in the universe. Aptakama, whatever He wills at once it comes to Him. "Let there be light," there was light. "Let there be water," there was water. Only willing is at the root of the incident.

So Govardhana daran, this Putana affairs, everything, only willing is at the back and it will immediately come to effect. That is the science of the supernatural things is like this. Just as we can will otherwise which is not found in this fossil science, what is not possible in the fossil science we can will that we can wish that. Why? 

So there is a scope outside, so we'll have to go that side. "Let there be water," there was water. "Let there be light," there was light. That basic conception we must have. From there we can go ahead. His sweet will, willing is possible, creation is possible by will power. Ideal realism, first the idea then it comes to be real. Everything, first idea then idea realises into so called reality in different planes of life. Do you follow?

Devotee: Yes Guru Maharaja.

Srila Sridhar Maharaj: You'll lose that basis and come with thousands of questions every time all the same and similar. First you have to take position with this universal conception of religious basis founding. You must take your position there firmly, then from there you will look around. You'll have to explain other things how it can come.

Planets and the law their existence all uncertain, unstable, all vanishes and again come. What is there position? Their firmness, their value, it is coming and going. The prime cause we are to study very attentively what is the nature of the prime cause Brahman from which everything is coming to our sight and again disappearing into that. 

We must not forget that we are trying to engage ourselves to study the nature of the prime cause and more and more higher. Always we take some mud and throw into that and begin to try and understand, "Why that is not like the mud, mud is all and why the God is not within the mud." 

Where does the mud exist when the whole creation is abolished? Where does this mud or the stone exist? Coming from where? Unseen quarter, un-understandable quarter, everything appears, the science also says like that, it appears and disappears.

So what is the nature of the root from when it is coming, and this coming thing is also undesirable. It is only giving pain to the soul. This is negative creation, not desirable. The proper creation which is desirable in svarupa-sakti land that is already there eternally. All religion to hear repeatedly but that does not have any trace in the heart, always in the material mud-plodding and sometimes enquiring about the ether, always in the mud and sometimes questioning about ether.

But we are to think through the soul, through soul we are to go to know the nature of the Supersoul area. This is all about that, Supersoul area. Freedom of soul is infinitely more extensive than the freedom of eye and the ear and the tongue and touch, infinitely higher and greater, the plane of soul within me. Just as the mind is more flexible and more spacious than this bodily experience. In dream we are more free than when we are awake in the world of our experience. In this way freedom is going up.

Aptakama, whatever one wills it comes immediately only it is within the jurisdiction of a particular soul, a yogi. A yogi whatever he will will: "I want one piece of rasagulla," rasagulla is there. Do you follow?

Devotee: Yes Maharaja.

Guru Maharaja: A soul in its higher realised position gets such power. Whatever he desires: "I want money," money is here. The soul can acquire such power. Then what about the Supreme Soul? Everything is possible. How much we can conceive miracles? Our brain, how much miracle can it conceive? Very little, it is always captured by this limited experience, our imagination always captured by our limited experience and cannot go high. 

More, more, more higher, every possibility is in the hand of the Absolute God. He's Absolute, Omnipotent, Omniscient, All Powerful, All Knowledge, and All Love. All love is Krsna, Vrndavana. All knowing is Narayana. And Siva and Brahma they're plodding in the mud. Siva half in the mud, half the head in eternity, and Brahma wholesale in the mud. And whenever any higher knowledge is extended through they can know to certain extent. "The miracle is everywhere connected with every religion conception. Then are they false or are they true? And to the oppositionists they are false. This general decision we must have before we approach any religion. This is a primary thing to understand for the beginner whether miracles we shall believe or not… 

So many miracles are here from every religious party, miracle. So a super-scientific adjustment, must be assimilation, we must have, when we enter in religious we'll have to have faith on many miracles. In the beginning when we go to take admission we must have such conviction, what is the miracles? Am I to believe or no, not to believe? If to believe, why? What is the reason? I must get explanation from me, and once I believe that then I can go there. 

The miracle is everywhere connected with every religion conception. Then are they false or are they true? And to the oppositionists they are false. This general decision we must have before we approach any religion. This is a primary thing to understand for the beginner whether miracles we shall believe or not. That they are all false or this science is false, the decision we shall have to take there if we are sincere to our self. Otherwise all religions are false and the atheistic science they are true. The most primary question in our enquiry. Then the particular solution to a particular miracle, but the common thing that we must have in a general way. 

Then we are to ask why? Why this lila, this aspect, why this miracle came, why that miracle came, what is the reason of showing that particular miracle? It is miracle to us, what is miracle I told what is miracle to the ordinary man awake then what is found in dream. If this is reality then dream is imaginary concoction. But if we learn to give more reality to the dream than our wakeful days, if I go to religion we are to do that. What is in mind that is coming out if it is not damaged otherwise when we recall.

indriyani parany ahur, indriyebhyah param manah
manasas tu para buddhir, buddher yah paratas tu sah
[Bhagavad-gita, 3.42]

["The learned proclaim that the senses are superior to inert objects, the mind is superior to the senses, and the faculty of resolute intelligence is superior to the mind. And he who is superior to the intelligence is the soul himself."]

That is primary, that is more fundamental, the mind is more fundamental than the effect of our experience, the sense experience world, mind has got more........

manasas tu para buddhir, the world of reason is more real than the world of mind and the world of sense experience. In this way, reality is going towards that. Manasas tu para buddhir, buddher yah paratas tu sah, that is atma, then Paramatma, then Vaikuntha, lila, and we are to have general conception the truth. And the transient characteristic falls and fighting amongst that is maya, the position of that experience. The mean conception of the sense experience and the higher conception of the revealed truth, we must have a general idea and details we are to enquire and get satisfaction.

The party is already there that man created God not that God created man, God is man's creation. And man created by the fossil, fossil is the ultimate reality, the fossil develops into the human body and human body can temporarily create what is said as soul. And the soul, that also conceiving creating God, that is another way.

And what system appeals to me. What party I am to join for my real benefit, sincere party, sincere joining a particular party. Not for any false purpose but to save me for my own highest interest I am joining the party. That soul, Supersoul, that is everything and this is the outcome, nasty thing. I shall go to join a religious party out and out, this sort of conception must be for that. Whom I regard more and it is for my own highest interest. Otherwise our joining a particular party that will be questionable.

The subtle is more powerful than the gross. The atomic bomb, question of the same life sent by our senses that contains so much power. Efficiency in the subtle things. We are to follow that line.
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[30.4.83]

Thanks to Julie Cluer´s facebook page for the contribution.